If you want to try something besides AA the satanic temple is doing their own peer support group for addiction.

  1. Hey friends! Lots of great discussion here and we love to see it. That said, friendly reminder to speak from the I, not insult anyone else's beliefs, not make comments just for the sake of stirring up shit, and keep it cordial. If you see anyone engaging in these types of comments, please don't get into an argument with them-- hit the "report" and us mods will take care of it. Thanks and carry on.

  2. Love how my most upvoted comment explores the intersection of alcoholism, Satan worship, and dad jokes. Love.

  3. TST and TCS are very very different. And they do not want to be affiliated with each other. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but the satanic temple is a group of atheist on a mission to separate church and state who know that being affiliated with Satan will bring the necessary attention to their mission.

  4. I'll share my perspective as an AA member while clarifying I totally respect that some folks are not going to jive with AA no matter what. In my experience, atheism does not have to be at odds with working a program in AA. Higher power, to me, can totally mean higher self. And that doesn't have to be a woo woo or literal thing, just a construct of one's self living their best life and adhering to their core values, an aspiration, a gut feeling.

  5. This is exactly how the higher power was explained to me. When I went to AA my HP was just myself essentially. Unfortunately I live in a very conservative area of the Bible Belt so the AA members are a little more aggressive.

  6. I totally understand the idea of a higher power as my higher self - my problem is that no one else in the meeting is using it that way. I just don't identify. and I'm in an area that is probably the least religious in the country.

  7. I practice a spirituality that has no God and it's an ancient tradition. I have no problem translating the 12 Steps to something that is in line with my non-belief.

  8. For me, I can't get past the "accept that you're powerless" thing in AA; which is why this is really resonating with me. I think the third tenet listed above is a better approach than treating alcohol as a big scary monster that only a higher power can save me from.

  9. every person in AA says some version of this when the topic comes up outside of a meeting. In the actual meetings, every single meeting is the Christian bible over and over and over.

  10. if there was another secular group as popular and widespread as AA it would help MORE people,continuing to support it does more harm than good when most people arent even going to step through the door.

  11. It’s really the best kind of trolling there is. They don’t give an F about Satan; they just want to make a few really really good points about organized religion and they do it well.

  12. There is nothing inherently evil about Satanism. Pardon my pun, it has one hell of a negative connotation. Most Satanists don't even worship Satan. They don't believe in any Higher Power, as you can read in tenets above. The best I've ever heard it described is that they aren't even atheists, they are "I"-theists.

  13. SMART recovery is well established and science based program. AA wasn’t for me at all, but I love smart. There are tons on online/zoom meetings everyday.

  14. Is this a virtual meeting or what? Do you have a link you can share? I am intrigued, I tried AA and was little turned off by it. I didn't hate it, just got a weird vibe. So if this is a legit alternative I'm open to giving it a try. Can you PM some info or something?

  15. The official launch is this Thursday the 29th; I assume they'll be giving more detailed info then. Hail Satan! Hail yourself!

  16. I've long said if I were pressed to join a religion again, it would be Buddhism because I really like the message and purpose of Buddha. But TST wins my heart because of their noble political aspirations.

  17. As a card holding member of the satanic temple, this is great to hear. They're an awesome group, nice to see they're branching out to helping people in other ways.

  18. Same! I'm particularly happy that they're fighting to be an option for court-mandated sobriety programs.

  19. The official launch is this Thursday the 29th; I assume they'll be giving more detailed info then. Hail Satan! Hail yourself!

  20. I know some people swear by AA, and if it works for them, good. But for me it’s a no. They swear they’re only ‘spiritual,’ not religious or Christian based. I’ve tried 3 times. Not for me. I’ll stick to therapy, CBT, art therapy, my weekly support groups through my rehab clinic, and my friends. I know that’s coming from a place of privilege since I have access to them, but for me, a huge combination of those things and professionals works.

  21. I was really fortunate to have a fantastic facility close to me so I could get clean. I still go to meetings there (big variety) and I have been attending an AA there even though I am not religious I liked the guy that ran it and a few of the regulars - well last week the meeting was so F'ing churchy I wanted to just walk out.

  22. That's really interesting to me, thanks for sharing. I really am not a fan of AA, and was a member of Refuge Recovery for awhile until a bunch of really gross stuff came out about the founder and it disgusted me to the point where I no longer wanted to participate. I think/hope this group will probably be more in line with what I need.

  23. The thing about AA is that every meeting is different -- it's only as good as the people there. They vary wildly. I've come across some amazing ones and some ones that weren't helpful at all.

  24. I’ve had similar experiences at some AA meetings others were more helpful. In the end it doesn’t matter how you chose to get sober as long as you get help and what you choose works for you. I put my energy into running and yoga now and when I get stressed or have an accomplishment i post here. It works for me I’m almost 10 months down now. Prolly wouldn’t work for others but I can’t say I agree with satanism it’s not something I believe in but that’s the wonderful thing about this country. I don’t have to for you to do it! If it works for you it works for you!

  25. If you would like to know more about TST but want to see them in action as well, I suggest the movie “Hail Satan?” Lots of interviews with the main guy Lucien and who they are and what being a satanist ACTUALLY means. Also their Hail satan! Hail Rick Scott! prank is sooooo fucking funny. The whole movie is honestly hilarious. Might be on Hulu? HBO Max?

  26. Read/listen to This Naked Mind by Annie Grace. Try a 30 day challenge. It might not work for everyone, but it changed my perspective on alcohol, which changed my life. I have recommended it several times to some close friends with a lot of success as well. Just another option. Hope this helps someone.

  27. +1 for This Naked Mind. Great read no matter where you are in your journey, it really frames the problem of alcohol differently.

  28. Every time I feel like slipping, I give this another listen (I have the audio version). Such a great book.

  29. That’s the biggest problem I had with AA. Give yourself to a higher power and all the good you do is attributed to the help from the higher power. Any time you backslide or slip up is ALL on you. Well where was the higher power when you were weak? And no, all the good came from me goddam it. I did that. I stayed sober.

  30. Yep. Responsibility and accountability are the opposite of giving myself up to some higher power. It is saying you are not responsible for your actions. I wish the Satanist had been a resource when I was getting sober.

  31. There are atheists groups of AA. For me group therapy is my higher power. It doesn't have to be a god in a religious sense, that's just the easiest way to define a higher power for most people.

  32. I actually just finished watching “Hail Satan?” On Hulu. I’m not big into organized religion, but what they stand for and how they conduct themselves is pretty inspiring. Their values give me hope. I’m not a member, but I can appreciate and respect what they are doing as humans for our world and humanity.

  33. Oh man, this is just what i need at the right time. I hope they follow throguh and have a good community. I desperately need it

  34. This is so dope! Thanks for the heads up, I've been struggling with AA and the ideals of not being enough to be my higher power. The conscious grid and unconscious collective is where I find power. Can I be sober on my own? Probably. Is it easier with a collective? Definitely. I most definitely prefer this thought process over the theological necessity.

  35. It's definitely for real. I think the chapters are primarily in the US currently, but I did find this:

  36. The official launch is this Thursday the 29th; I assume they'll be giving more detailed info then. Hail Satan! Hail yourself!

  37. My therapist mentioned that if you scoop out all the aa gobbledygook it's just as effective as spending time with other people in recovery.

  38. Reminds me of the experiment with the mice that were addicted. If they were isolated they kept giving in but when they had a community they voluntarily gave up whatever it was. I think they put cocaine or sugar in the water. I don’t think the experiment was ever replicated but I think the important lesson still stands that together, regardless of faith or lack thereof, we can help each other.

  39. Oh HELL yeah! I am excited for this. TST likes science and I’m hoping they will create a science based program. While I don’t like the higher power in AA I also really think the “steps” are very odd and not based on any sound behavioral change theories. Be nice to have something less antiquated in the mix.

  40. I’m glad to see this here. I have a relative deep in the “rock bottom” area we always hear one has to reach. He hasn’t stopped but AA has absolutely not been helpful partially because it’s so heavily faith based. It’s problematic for people who don’t have those beliefs.

  41. Is that not a power greater than yourself? I mean, if that's what turns you off about AA than this is probably the same thing. But ultimately, if you want to get sober and stay sober use every means available to you to do so. Sobriety is effing great!

  42. Well it kinda has to be extremely anti-christian for it to work. The whole point is to try and keep the government secular. If some bible thumping politician wants to put up a Jesus statue, if someone demands a Buddhist statue there wont be much outcry. But if that christian politician has to also put up a statue of satan, its gonna look way worse on them. So they either cower out from pushing jesus with the government, or they also push satan with it.

  43. That’s the point of this organization. They’re not actually satanists. They preach that regardless of religion people shouldn’t be jerks to each other. If you read the tenets they’re all about being a good person because you can be without outside influence.

  44. The name is because they push it to point out the ludicrous efforts of some people in the government to put Christian imagery everywhere. If you do that you have to do it equally for all religions or don’t do it for any. They’re most about keeping the freedom from religion thing alive and all that. The name grabs your attention. Their acts really show you how the organization really operates and defends people’s right to not be religiously persecuted.

  45. The satanic temple is not actually satanism, It focuses on social Justice, freedom, separation of state and religion. I'm not sharing this to change your mind, just letting you know that the satanic temple is different than run of the mill Satanism.

  46. So don't be fooled by how reasonable and enlightened they are. We should believe the side that is consistently unreasonable and unenlightened.

  47. Are you thinking about The Church of Satan, founded by Anton LaVey? Totally different than this.....Don’t most all religions make themselves out to be reasonable and enlightened? To each their own. Whatever gets you off the sauce.

  48. I dislike any form of elitism. Religious or not. Just accept that whatever god you fancy was also there when you were hooked on the alcohol. You cant pick and choose right from wrong at that point.

  49. Yes, as a religious person, I concur that that shit ain't no fucking joke. Never claimed to be good though.

  50. Okay? Stop commenting a bunch of weird stuff and go on about your life then. If it’s not for you that’s fine just move along then, nobody is forcing you to attend it. You’re in no place to judge what does and doesn’t work for other people and their journey.

  51. To be clear, aa where I’m from emphasises that it’s a higher power of your own choosing- and demonstrably works, so if you want to worship Satan then go ahead! Just do the steps

  52. It’s not that kind of satanism, but either way. Different things work for different people, having another tool in the belt never hurt anyone.

  53. I'm not particularly religious, but as a lifelong metalhead, I find this amusing if not particularily useful. I won't be doing anything with the Satanic temple, but it's good to get the word out that there are alternatives available.

  54. That was my intention but it seems that some people can’t seem to accept that there’s different strokes for different folks. I don’t care how you do it, I want you to keep coming back to whatever brought you here in the first place.

  55. Proud contributor to TST, here.. not only because of their political stance, support of all things great and legal prowess.. the awesome swag! Boom - and now I know they can assist with pandemic box-o-wine back to the proverbial, single bottle of Jesus blood? Hell yes!

  56. Haha I am thinking of how this conversation would go with my Mormon mother. I have found my sobriety and love of my self through the church of Satanism. Haha I'm 30 and still find ways to push her buttons. I'm a horrible child.

  57. Whatever works...Me. If i were starting a movement I would keep it simpler. And would mention drugs and alcohol somewhere. AA got this right, you can't do much self repair if you are still drinking so it's gotta be step 1.

  58. These are just the tenets for the temple, not the program or peer group or any of that. I figured some people weren’t familiar with TST so I put them up there for some background.

  59. Wow this totally made my day, I remember looking into Satanism years ago and thought it was very Rational. Definitely interested in joining the online group and talking with some sober satanists!

  60. I'm not seeing anything here that can even approach the issue of alcoholism, "...in accordance with reason" & "...guiding principle designed to inspire nobility..." simply have no meaning to those who cannot discern the true from the false - if you chose this path, good luck

  61. This is not the program, I posted the tenets to give people an idea of what TST is actually about since a lot of people see Satan and assume the worst. It’s actually going to be a peer support group like AA without all the religion.

  62. This is bold..... but very reasonable. Cant say indignities satanic name attached but alcoholics and addicts should have an open mind to what works for them

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