Need to dump the Flylady

  1. Really, FlyLady's peak was when _Sink Reflections_ was published. Everything after that seemed more and more a money grab for FlyLady merch. I get the need to offer it for the "swag" factor, but it shouldn't feel necessary to succeed in the strategy.

  2. I really get pissed when I see these systems and it seems like the kids and spouses in the house just leave crap around for women to clean. WTF? You don’t know how to place a dish in the dishwasher? It seems so disrespectful

  3. UFYH and A Slob Comes Clean. UFYH had an app if you like reminders (i have to admit i never used it, i just know it exists).

  4. Dana K. White of a Slob Comes Clean is a religious church-going SAHM who lives in Texas. As far as I know she's never discussed politics or gone much deeper into religion than "God inspired me to start this blog" but there are some reasonable assumptions you can make.

  5. As a former flybaby (like 15 years ago), I haven't been inspired until I came across KC Davis aka strugglecare aka @domesticblisters on TikTok. She has a counseling degree and pretty good insights.

  6. Wow, thank you for that story. It's a thing I notice all too often now: Cult mentality. Especially with that particular demographic (which I am a part of... But not crazy).

  7. Oh wow :O Unfuck Your Habitat is pretty good, but reading the first Marie Kondo book was most helpful for me (I would avoid secondhand recaps and her tv show because it glosses over a lot of things and you really just need the basic part.)

  8. Check out Clean Mama. She does a sort of stream lined version of Flylady, a lot of people prefer it actually. You could try adding zone work to the Clean Mama routine for a more complete system.

  9. She lost me as soon as I realized 1) it was all aimed at stay at homes and 2) "purple puddles" were mentioned way too often. It doesn't surprise me that she's a wingnut too.

  10. I always kinda ignored the super fluffy stuff, 'purple puddles' and all that. I just like the checklists, to be honest. Lately she has not done more than prattle on and play those horrid songs. This latest thing was just the last straw.

  11. Once I signed up, I got endless email clutter pitching her Purple Products. Thank you for alternative suggestions.

  12. I’m with you. I can’t stand her “God Breezes” either. I always knew that she was a hard core evangelical, it’s too bad she’s gone down the rabbit hole.

  13. Yes I was going to suggest this one. She takes inspiration from a few different systems and explains what works for her. Her email video helped me gain control over my inbox.

  14. Thank you for letting us know. I won’t suggest her site anymore- people who are overwhelmed with clutter don’t need a large helping of crazy conspiracy theories to add to their stress.

  15. Right? I remember finding her site like 15 years ago and thinking "lol nope". She creates more work for people, rather than helping them take control of the work that keeps slipping through.

  16. The 'wipe down your sink' every night was the one that had me off her site. I think it's geared for SAHMs? I like when my partner and I share housework and for some reason 'wiping down' the bathroom every night felt more like servitude than a shared living space :/

  17. Wait wouldn't wearing shoes in the house make it LESS clean? I have a maple tree by my house I track little leaves all over if I wear them inside for even a second. Guess it would help you need more cleaning checklists haha

  18. There is something in it though - but yeah, outdoor shoes = gross. I started wearing lace up indoor shoes (just trainers really, that I didn't use to go outside), and it made a difference. So now I have outdoor shoes, a pair of lace up indoor shoes for cleaning and tidying, and indoor relaxing shoes (slippers). I find it helps my brain get in the appropriate gear for some reason.

  19. I never wear lace ups in the house, I wear my Oofoos for comfort and still do the routine just fine. I just noped out of the shoe part, is all, lol :)

  20. I am sorry to hear that. I have followed her for years off and on, but really didn't watch her video much, just liked her system. I use a flylady group on facebook for cleaning camaraderie when it's time to clean, and there's never a discussion, it's just say what you're cleaning and check it off. I haven't gotten her emails for years either.

  21. Yes! Check out Diane in Demark. She is NOT religious (unlike so many home bloggers out there) and mixes in advice from a variety of "systems" (atomic habits, getting things done, etc). Her focus is always on establishing good routines and finding what works for you - there is no one size fits all. She keeps her videos under 20 minutes and doesn't ramble on endlessly. I enjoy her videos and encouragement without the weird fundamental Christian housewife propaganda or closing prayers.

  22. I never followed flylady so I don't know anything about her system but I highly recommend Melissa Maker on Youtube

  23. I like "Do It On a Dime" on Youtube. She definitely has ENERGY but seems pretty secular. Her main thing is ridiculous crafts but she has some cleaning videos

  24. I’m Canadian; I don’t know everything about American politics; I’m assuming who you’re describing is a political figure; she definitely leans right & doesn’t hide it. She’s definitely open about her religious beliefs, too. As an atheist and not a Republican, I find her personal beliefs difficult to swallow, and that’s why I’ve had to stop watching her videos. I did find them useful to learn about housekeeping and decluttering and structure. I would go crazy trying to do too much and she taught me about resting and other things (why to wear shoes, why getting dressed is important, etc.) and I don’t find you learn that elsewhere. But yeah, she can be too much. But she maintains that if you don’t like her, leave her.

  25. Fellow Canadian here. Jim Caviezel is a actor. He was the main character in Person Of Interest (tv show). He also had some supporting roles in a number of movies.

  26. I looked at her stuff for a bit years ago. The “go shine your sink” was pretty good advice, at least the way I took it (don’t leave a mess in the kitchen before you go to sleep so you have a nicer morning). Then I read “get up and put your shoes on!” and thought “ew, no, have you seen a sidewalk?” before realizing that no, she probably actually hasn’t.

  27. She used to be very different. She expressed pride in the diversity of her fan base and encouraged people to adapt the system to fit the variety of life styles we had. And then somehow the vibe changed. 2005, 2006 perhaps?

  28. Honestly she was relatively neutral on politics and religion until around 2015-ish. I honestly miss what it once was because she was great at no nonsense advice. Now it’s crazy prayer shawls and praying and crying half the time.

  29. As an atheist mom who works 2 part time jobs, I have long wanted a cleaning/organizing guru who left out ALL the religion and such. Clutterbug is perhaps my favorite - all about organizing and such, but she doesn't much get into the daily routines for a cleaner space.

  30. Oh, that looks interesting...I was walking down the hallway a minute ago thinking I needed to set up a chores list. Came back, saw this.

  31. Ahhhh!!! I never subscribed to her but know who you are talking about. That's awful bc she has a huge fanbase of easily influenced people imo...

  32. I’m so sorry this happened to someone who touched and inspired you, despite not personally knowing them. I had that happen a few times durring this pandemic and I think it’s horrible.

  33. I’ve really struggled with figuring out things who doesn’t make me itch in this space. I’ve been watching a YouTuber called ButFirstCoffee and so far, so good, but yeah this scene is crowded with people who want to promote their political and religious beliefs.

  34. It's really hard. So many of my interests - cooking, decluttering, frugality, gardening, crafting - lead directly to right wing christians online.

  35. I signed up on her site a couple years ago on a friend’s recommendation. I liked some of her initial ideas, the cleaning of the sink and stuff made sense to me, but she lost me as soon as I started receiving multiples emails every day from her, and her insisting that each one was important. How can you advocate a clutter-free home while you insist on cluttering up my inbox? Clutter goes beyond just your physical space, it starts in your head, and your virtual space is part of it too. I didn’t find her website very clutter-free either. Just wasn’t for me.

  36. Oh good grief. I found and then unfound her back in like 2007, and I got such an awful vibe from the whole thing. I love the idea of setting a timer for both work and rest because I’m disabled and it’s hard to get focused and then easy to overdo it… but the selling of stuff, the overly cutesy bullshit, one series of emails about how cleaning your house leads to weight loss, and the CONSTANT emails just turned me right off.

  37. I got sick of the emails too. Especially the ones with the underlying message of you got to this point because you are lazy and depressed. No I got to this point because I have a chronic illness and struggled to get out of bed and look after my toddles let alone do anything else.

  38. Cleaning bites podcast is really good. She’s just getting started though so there’s not much content, but I feel like lots more is coming soon. Totally intelligent, not religious, nor a conspiracy quack.

  39. I highly recommend Secret Slob on YouTube! She started off with flylady but I much prefer what she's made of it, which is a less overwhelming and more realistic system. She's relatable, encouraging, and lovely!

  40. Fly lady is no lady. She verbally and publicly dismembers anyone who dares question or suggest a modification to her methods. Jesus H. Caviziel is as nutty as Mel H. Christgibson. They need to declutter their brains and egos.

  41. Yes that’s around when I unsubbed from the emails. I’d taken what I needed from the system by then and then in 2016 the day before the vote she voiced her support for Trump which either way you vote she shouldn’t be using her platform to get political in my opinion and secondly the reason why she said she was voting that way seemed potentially alienating for a large part of her fan base and it had no place being mentioned there. Really disappointed to hear that she’s deeper into it than even that.

  42. I don't know about the system but I like to listen to a podcast called Clean With Me. She usually updates twice a week and does a once-a-week full house clean and a once-a-week 20-minute clean.

  43. I used to follow FlyLady years ago, but was always uncomfortable with the right-wing culture that came along with the housecleaning. I loved the book "Unf*ck Your Habitat: You're Better Than Your Mess." I borrowed the audiobook from the library and listened to it while I cleaned. I did this so often that I eventually bought my own copy.

  44. Joined ufyh . Was happy to hear about the way illness is understood... Chronic pain makes it hard to get things done. Kindness is good to hear sometimes.

  45. I swear by Unfuck Your Habitat. I have her checklists on my fridge and she doesn't assume you're a stay-at-home spouse. She also includes advice for people with roommates, people with pets, people who need to use laundromats, all those very normal situations that most cleaning sites tend to leave out.

  46. I second the suggestion for Melissa Maker, her channel is Clean My Space on YouTube. Here's one of her Daily Cleaning Routine vids:

  47. I bailed on Flylady probably a decade ago because the tone and trappings were driving me crazy (all of the fluffy stuff that seemed aimed at Being a Good Wife and the overly cutesy terminology among them). A few years ago I found UFYH: bought her app, and her book, and follow the checklists on her Patreon, and it's helped a LOT.

  48. I'm loving the audiobook...LOVE how she reminded me that I don't live in this house alone. Lol Other people here need to pitch in.

  49. Her system is like constantly clean and be completely controlled by your morning, evening, hot spot etc, routines. I tried it and my house looked great but I was constantly cleaning or thinking about cleaning. I still do the 15 minute timer thing when company is coming over but I don’t want my whole life to be about keeping house. Figures she is a crazy nut, it’s easy to see she is extreme in her personal life as well. She sent me probably 100’s of emails like “ have you checked your grout lines today?” Super annoying!

  50. Try Millenial Minimalist podcast for a good podcast to listen to while you clean or declutter. Clutterbug has a fun “what type of organiser are you” quiz too

  51. Yeah, I use to listen to her Q&A videos, but had to stop too. I think she started getting particularly bad last year. Like before I knew she was conservative and she could be rude to people, but she became very overtly conspiracy-minded over time.

  52. I printed out and laminated her printables so we can use the checklists over and over with dry erase markers! She’s got an excellent system. I appreciate that there is a time limit for each day’s tasks.

  53. Glad you posted about this. I've recommended her website to others before even though I never got into it, as it seemed geared for people with a very different lifestyle. I won't be doing so going forward.

  54. Yeah, I jumped ship on Flylady years ago because I could see the writing on the walls. I've taken part of her system, (zones, I love zones) and married it to UFYH, and a splash of like five other systems, and put it all in Tody. Clean Mama is good, and has some great printables for sale, I love A Slob Comes Clean's down-to-earthness (also that woman is so ADHD so her way of thinking meshes well with mine), Julie Morgenstern's books (Time Management from the Inside Out, and Organizing from the Inside Out) helped me not miss anything. I double book in Tody and Bullet Journalling, I like thinking on paper, but reminders digitally. Oh and a dash of GTD. And I don't remember who says "Catching up takes longer than keeping up" but its great advice.

  55. I cant believe Fly Lady is still a thing. I unsubscribed from her emails in like 2005 because she was uncomfortably religious. UFYH is a fine substitute.

  56. I need structure. I don’t watch fly lady YouTube. I just use her app and system via her website, for now. I tried a tea time with her once, nope, nope, nope not for me and I am a Christian. I am also going to look into others suggestions here. Good luck my friend.

  57. Dana K White - A slob comes clean. Her two books have been life changing for my home. Decluttering at the speed of life and How to Manage Your Home without losing your Mind

  58. That is sad to hear. She seemed like a down to earth person who wanted people to have clean homes. I never watched her videos, only did the free emails for a bit. I liked how she said don't worry about catching up, start with this weeks zone chart, etc. This thread gave a lot of other good suggestions so thank you for posting.

  59. I am sorry. I like Cas from ClutterBug and have for years. She has a paid course with Dana from A Slob Comes Clean - Dana's also pretty good - and Dawn from The Minimal Mom. I really, really don't like Dawn's content for a variety of reasons so I avoid any of their shared stuff but Cas and Dana are great.

  60. I had the same experience with Clean With Me! It's just not what I want to pay with my clicks and time . I liked the way it was formatted, but it got weird.

  61. Have you tried Tody app? It’s $6 but keeps track of how often you want to do cleaning/organizing tasks in each room of your house, garden, garage etc.

  62. Another recommendation of UFYH. it is a lifechanger in terms of philosophy of decluttering, doing what you can to keep your house clean enough, and living your life in a less stressful way when it comes to your home, chores, and stuff.

  63. There is a YouTube channel I like called the secret slob. She follows the flylady system, but she has modified it a bit. She has her own printables and getting started series, if you want the same thing just not from flylady.

  64. I used to follow Fly Lady about 15 or 20 years ago. Honestly I am not that surprised by what you are saying, at all. It seems like she would follow them with all her talk of "blessings".

  65. It's always been flagrantly obvious that Flylady is a conservative Christian. Not sure why you or anyone else who's familiar with her is so surprised by this.

  66. Ugh I just discovered the app and the system a few days ago and it has helped me. BUT I could see some phrasing that I assumed was aimed at a certain lifestyle and belief set. I don’t see myself as her “target market” but it didn’t make the content less valuable. But now I’m not sure if I should continue to use the app with this new info about the creator.

  67. Did you pay for it? Does it help you? If the answers are 'no' and 'yes' than use it. Don't sign up for emails or watch her YT 😒

  68. There is not enough recommendations for @domesticblisters in this thread! She is amazing. A totally different approach to cleaning, but still offers ways to have the structure of something like FlyLady. Take a look at her site, she has some really good free printables. Even if you hate tiktok with a passion, she’s worth downloading the ap for, lol. I think you can see all her content on her site though anyway.

  69. Dang. I always shout Flylady’s system from the rooftops on Reddit bc it seriously changed my life many years ago. It’s beyond disappointing to hear she’s a Q Anon wacko.

  70. I think the simple basic break down of her program makes it easy to follow. I never watched her YT before but the habits I formed from her will probably stay with me forever. Does anyone have recommendations for others to follow with a similar approach?

  71. This is my issue with a lot of self-help videos on Youtube. Aside from some of the youtubers having weirdass political views, there's a buttload of self-promotion to make people feel insufficient about themselves and "hooked." This isn't strictly just a Youtube thing, either. Any self-help media can end up dragging its audience into this self-hate sinkhole--even when it's started with the best intentions.

  72. I tried subscribing to the Flylady emails for a brief time some years ago. I felt put off by what seemed like an ad-fest. I don’t begrudge people trying to sell things but the Flylady website seemed to go overboard with ads.

  73. There's no denying that Marla is bat shit crazy. On the other hand, I've been doing her program for so long I can't not do it. So. The app is free and I don't have to buy her stuff or listen to her podcast or get her email reminders. And I'm just gonna keep on keepin on with my own damn happy self, tyvm :)

  74. I learned about The FlyLady System through Steph, TheSecretSlob on YouTube. I Tried to watch FlyLadys channel, but it was waaayy too much, Steph was short, sweet, and to the point. She has free printable on her site that have helped me out big time!

  75. If the system works for you, and you’ve already learned it, why do you have to change things? You don’t have to keep giving her money or continue consuming her content just to use her system, do you? No matter how awful she is, this seems like cutting off your nose to spite your face.

  76. I'm going to use what I learned, but not consume her content anymore. I do want to try other content creators though. I like listening while I clean.

  77. Who cares of who she is, it's a method you use, you dont throw money at her. I hate Marie Kondo and her views on gender roles but meh, her method work.

  78. As a hardcore atheist, I don't care about their politics or religion but I have to admit I'll keep watching and doing the system.

  79. I still buy Nike shoes because they fit well despite Nike using Uyghur slave labor. I use products with cobalt and other minerals mined by children. I eat Chick-fil-A. If the system works for you... Everything in perspective

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