Did you know some school districts in central Ohio are allowing churches to pull kids out during their public school day for religious instruction at the expense of other classes?

  1. With respect to how it’s legal: There is a SCOTUS case on the subject - Zorach v. Clauson. The classes have to be voluntary and not school-supported or funded. In some parts of Ohio, this has been happening for decades.

  2. As someone who grew up in rural NW Ohio, I can confirm. This has been going on over 20 years, especially in small Catholic communities

  3. I wouldn’t care if it wasn’t during the school day and kids didn’t miss instruction time. In my town, they miss specials to do it. Specials are important.

  4. There’s a school nearby that does this. It’s “voluntary” but if you don’t participate, you get shunned by both peers and teachers/coaches. It’s ridiculous that we allow this to happen

  5. My kids go to Jonathon alder, in plain city. They sent out something recently notifying parents of this option and I immediately wanted to start an after school Satan club

  6. Yes. It has to occur off of school property and be funded by an outside, private group. The school board has to pass an amendment to their governing docs (not sure what these are called) that allows for the program. Lifewise Academy, the one I assume you’re talking about, gives interested districts the language that they need to use in order to vote on and potentially allow the district to do these programs.

  7. Is the religious program allowed to exclude students with disabilities too? Sorry, I’m still trying to wrap my head around this. From the twitter thread, “Note this is after a parent highlighted how to program is not even open to students w disabilities bc the disability resources don’t carry over to the off campus program”

  8. Yep, I live next to a church. Every Thursday from 1-2p a bus brings kids in. Even the afterschool homework help club here asks for your permission to pray with your child before the session starts. They really push it here.

  9. I've written quite a bit about this actually. Provided it is off school property, privately funded, and opt-in for parents, it is completely legal.

  10. I know someone who volunteers/donates to Lifewise. Evangelicals love to give $$$ to causes that they think will ‘fix’ America

  11. This is nothing new. They did that when I was in elementary school back in the 70s. We use to go to the YMCA a couple of blocks up the street from the school. I'm not religious and never have been.

  12. I had a lot of friends get pulled out of school regularly for Hebrew School. They were mostly not republicans. Same things with Islamic age school children. People trying to make this a right vs. left issue is stupid. This pearl clutching going on in this thread over something that has been happening for 50+ years is ridiculous.

  13. It's absolutely insidious. The goal is to teach religious principles, under the guise of teaching "character." The duplicitous nature of not just fessing up to what they actually want to teach makes it insidious. If the goal was "build moral character consistent with Christian beliefs," then why does Lifewise's curriculum emphasize the stories of the Garden of Eden, Abraham, and Noah?

  14. Did you also know that classical academy charter schools are opening all over Ohio with state tax money? And they’re usually founded by Christian’s and teach right wing Hillsdale College curriculum?

  15. My kids came home with Lifewise letters stuffed into their folders the first day of school. My wife flipped out about it. I just tossed them in the trash and we agreed that if any of our kids come home and have been pressured about this even once, we'll take it up with whom it concerns.

  16. They are starting this in our school district. I have not received an answer on this, but if you pull them out during their “specials” (here it would be like art, music, PE, and STEM), how do they get graded? Because they do receive grades for their specials (in our district anyway). If they’re consistently missing a class, how do they pass the class, or do they simply not get graded for that?

  17. No, but close. It’s the Center for Christian Virtue. Who are intimately invested in multiple draconian bills to suppress anyone who isn’t a white Christian. They’re directly involved in writing HBs 616, 454, and all the anti-abortion stuff. They BOUGHT land across from the Statehouse even. They are well funded fascists spreading across the entire state.

  18. But, that's literally what voluntary means for kids. Anyone under 18 is a minor and is legally subject to their parents will.

  19. My church does this in other states, but in ohio it's done before school. Kids drive themselves, I never knew one of them that felt forced to go, but it's definitely possible.

  20. I wouldn't say it's a cult. The parents are instilling their moral and ethical values. It's very peculiar that people are upset with parents raising their children with faith based values but seemingly have a great amount of pride and joy for educators pushing sexual/gender identity, LGBTQ+ activism, and rewritten history. Maybe that one is the cult.

  21. Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

  22. Parents can homeschool or have their kids go to private school or have their kids do after school and weekend religion classes.

  23. They are doing it in my town. School board voted it in, kids miss specials to attend. It’s unacceptable.

  24. Then don't allow your kid to attend. I am really failing to see where the problem is here. No one is forcing anything on anyone.

  25. I did this when I was younger, though in another state. According to the school, it’s officially labeled as “release time” or a free period. The students are free to do what they want with their free period, including going to the religious class. I will note though that this class had no state or school funding, and the building the class was taught in wasn’t even on school property.

  26. To be fair, I don’t think that this is new. I went to elementary in middle school in northeast Ohio in the 80s and 90s and I swear I remember classmates being excused from class or coming to class late for religious instruction of some kind. If memory serves, it was Catholic and/or Jewish kids, not the fundies.

  27. The issue is kids missing out on classes that educate them, make them well rounded, and introduce them to subjects that might end up shaping their career and turning them into productive, successful Ohioans.

  28. A lot of people pointing out how it's voluntary and doesn't affect those who don't participate, but it effectively reduced my class time even though I didn't participate

  29. That is not good practice by that teacher then. They can use that time even if they do not want to cover new content because of absent/excused kids.

  30. I just want to point out that when I say "we did it in the 80s/90s" in 2022 it hits exactly the same to your ears today as an old guy telling me at that age that "we did it that way in the 40s/50s." There's no way I would have accepted that argument then, and I shouldn't accept it as validation now. I would have said "that's some Leave it to Beaver shit grandpa" and done a sick kickflip.

  31. So should a poor Muslim child not be allowed to miss class time to pray? Or a Jewish child not allowed leave for one of the Jewish holidays that others do not participate in? I don't like the Christian faith, but that doesn't mean I think we should strip their rights away, or we become like the far right that want strip abortion rights, and trans rights away. There are several programs that have been around forever that allow parents to pull their kids out of non-core classes. Some religious, and some not. While we may not like these ones, we don't have to send our kids to them. No one should tell you how to raise your children, and you shouldn't tell others. Want more of a change? Get involved, or create a program that teaches what you think would be right. Then take your kids out of classes to participate, and invite others at the school to do the same. Nothing is stopping anyone from doing the same, just takes more than being loud on the internet about it.

  32. My wife and SIL did this also for 2 hours a week for religious classes in small town Ohio and that was back in the eighties. It was a 100% voluntary program students AND parents had to knowingly sign up for.

  33. It’s the current trend to hate on Christians and parents who don’t want their kids to learn all this gobbledygook that’s been in schools.

  34. Reading the actual rules of the program from the state, it's not crazy. If it's voluntary, meets certain specifications, is paid for privately, and doesn't cause the kid to miss other classes it can be approved.

  35. I honestly didn’t know this wasn’t the norm. My school district had voluntary religious classes, held off school grounds, once a week in K-6th and that was from 2000-06. I remember each year my parents had to sign off on allowing attendance too and the kids who didn’t go to it basically just got study hall.

  36. I don't see a problem with this. We teach the beliefs of non-christian religions all day in school, on the rac payer dime. We teach the beliefs of the leftist religions and the beliefs of progressivism, which can be classified as a cult/religion at the tax payer expense, why not allow Christians to travel to a different building to learn things that coincide with their values?

  37. I'm not a fan of organized religion but my God name a better duo than reddit and their hate of religion. Parents pick how they raise their kids. Just as some parents want to take their kids to pride parades some parents want to raise their kids in the church. You can judge but at the end of the day it's the parents choice.

  38. Cool. Do it at home. If you want to do it during school hours, homeschool or send them to a religious private school.

  39. If you believe in your religion and your religion says “God first” then I suppose it could be understandable why someone would put religious teachings over school teachings.

  40. Legal is one thing, I don’t understand why you’d want to, other then the general wackiness of really religious people I meet. One of the religious people I know mentioned that the Christian school community generally thinks and believes all that BS about public schools grooming kids. I guess it’s not a shock given they believe a lot from some old book that likely is 98% made up crap.

  41. As long as it's not preventing them from achieving their graduation requirements; I don't see why it matters if it detracts from their other classes.

  42. Yep, this is old news. My High School has a "Prayer Club" that meets but always has a disclaimer, even next to their picture in the yearbook, that it is not endorsed by the schools

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