Anyone else switch sides after today's episode?

  1. Thank you for your post! Please take a moment to ensure you are within our spoiler rules, to protect your fellow fans from any potential spoilers that might harm their show watching experience.

  2. "When I was 12, I milked my eel into a pot of turtle stew. I flogged the one-eyed snake. I skinned my sausage. I made the bald man cry into the turtle stew, which I do believe my sister ate. At least I hope she did. Once I brought a jackass and a honeycomb - into a brothel..."

  3. The new maester clearly concocted something to keep him alive. We saw him make the suggestion last episode but was shut down by the boomer. People say show don't tell, but when they do it everyone still acts confused. The old grandmaester is also clearly dead.

  4. The book is unique how it gives in universe alternative explanations to event (since they use multiple sources) but I like that HOTD gives a more or less canonical version of events.

  5. Not to mention how he came off as wanting to be even more involved in his sons lives. And what happened after he and his father went back to Harrenhal.

  6. Viserys is a weak fool. The Heleana/Jacaerys match should’ve been immediately accepted and them betrothed. When Alicent objects, he should’ve told her to shut up. He’s the king. And her angry reaction at the match wouldn’t be the first time a queen would be angry abt having no say in her children’s politically advantageous matches .

  7. When she told him he could do what he wants when she’s “cold in the grave” I was like ??? Now would be a good time to remind her that you are the king, dude. She can be mad about it but you are supposed to have the final say.

  8. Seriously. I can’t believe he didn’t immediately say yes to Rhaenyra and fuck what Alicent thought. Especially since he wants his family to come together.

  9. Seriously. When she said over my dead body or whatever I thought, well that's easy enough to arrange, bye.

  10. I mean that is basically who Viserys is lol. If you read whats said about him in the books, it's literally worse. he at least has some depth to his character on the show. I think it was a belief in the books that the cuts he was getting from sitting on the throne was him being rejected as he was just unfit to be king.

  11. Exactly!! Like Tyrion made a match for Marcella while hand, hand not King. And Cersei had to go with it. Why when THE HEIR suggests a perfect solution does the king not immediately accept and tell Allicent to suck it!!

  12. Yup. One of the many single actions that could have changed the shitshow that's about to come. An heir born from that match would be backed by the Hightowers, Velaryons, and Targaryens. Done.

  13. I think Alicent doesn’t think women should rule and probably doesn’t think they should be speaking up in those matters. She seems to follow what women were expected to do, just have children.

  14. yea its mind boggling to think how much better her life would be if her father never made her do that. i mean fuck, she's been absolutely miserable her entire life since that moment. never once being in a relationship with someone she loves and also losing her best friend.

  15. Right, when Otto left his attitude was all "I am trying to protect you and your children from the very dangerous position you're in" THAT HE PUT THEM IN. Literally all he would have had to do to keep Allicent safe, was not put her in front of the king. What an ass.

  16. Thank you! You put it in much better words than I on why I dislike the Hightower’s. Like how dare you guys get mad and defensive about a situation you put yourselves in.

  17. Otto’s relationship with Alicent was frightening. You could see how afraid she was of him, how much control he had over her. He made her like this

  18. And to think all the kids would have just grow up as ''family'' and there would be no need for any blood if Alicent wasnt power hungry and paranoid. Both Cole and Alicent are kidding themselves thinking they are the right ones.

  19. Yeah Alicent is supposedly motivated by the fear of her children being killed by Rhaenyra but 1. We have seen zero indication that Rhaenyra has any desire to do that and 2. ALICENT LITERALLY JUST TURNED DOWN THE GUARANTEED SAFETY OF ALL OF HER CHILDREN

  20. Except if Jace and Halaena got married, Aegon and Aemond would’ve been safe somewhere doing knight work while Rhaenyra is Queen. But Alicent rejected the offer, because she wants her son to be a King. It’s ambition at this point, not her trying to protect her kids

  21. I didn’t see Aegon as being a bully outright. He said he didn’t want to challenge Rhaenyra’s rule and the kids all seemed to get along in the dragon pit for the most part.

  22. Yeah, reminded me of when I met the parents of the “bully” at my school, and all of a sudden I realized it could have been so so much worse.

  23. Honestly: Aegon is just acting like a stupid teenager. Which he is. A bratty teenager (given his position) but a teenager nontheless. And yes indeed, egged on by criston. I dont think he hates his nephews at this point.

  24. Yeah it's exactly that. In the interview with the showrunners they said they're exploring how grudges and goals are passed down to the next generation.

  25. This episode cemented for me that Criston Cole is a nasty little gremlin. Bullying literal children and belittling her for her romantic choices, when all he wants is to be with her too. He’s so bitterly jealous that Rhaenyra found Strong and is happy. Cole has always cared more about himself and wanted her to give up everything for her even when he wasn’t willing to do the same. Now, he spends all his free time badmouthing her to her worst enemy and bullying kids. I hope a dragon steps on him.

  26. I legit kept saying "Shit up Criston" everytime he was on screen. I'm just so sick of his shit. Hell, even Alicent seemed done with his bullshit when he called Rhaenyra a cunt.

  27. I find it funny that Criston is so bothered by Harwin and Rhaenyra ! She literally said she wanted them to remain as they were when they first began, and he was so cunt stricken that he refused. That is nobody’s fault but his own, he has no room to feel any sort of way.

  28. Yep. He cannot get over the fact that she didn't want to run away with him (who would?!?! the dick isn't THAT good) but offered to keep him as her situationship on the side, but then she went and found his better in Strong and the man said yes.

  29. Yeah, the people who say Rhaenyra is evil don’t know what evil is, because if I were in her shoes I would have already arranged an “accident” to befall that creepy incel, and my wicked stepmother, too.

  30. It seems to me the sides have switched. Rhaenyra went from being selfish and unconcerned to being dutiful as a wife, mother, and future Queen. She is still fucking Harwin Strong sure, but at the same time she understands the importance of being a future ruler as evidenced during the Council.

  31. I wholeheartedly believe that things would've gone completely differently had she not had that one conversation with Otto as he was leaving. The idea of Rhaenyra being forced to eliminate her sons has poisoned her brain to the point that she can think of no other alternative scenario. And in being so dedicated to the idea, she's willing it into existence. It's a classic self-fulfilling prophecy.

  32. Alicent doesn't see it that way. In her mind, she's done her duty and produced spare heirs for some withering old dude for the honour of House Hightower. She resents Rhaenyra for her privilege and she's jealous that she has wiggled her way out of her obligations and has managed to have children with a man she truly desires. It's a luxury Alicent was not afforded and she feels cheated.

  33. Yeah but she actually doesn’t truly care about the welfare of her children, or she would’ve accepted the betrothal proposition that would’ve guaranteed the survival of her children.

  34. Everyone brings up jealousy which may play a part but it's not just Alicent who thinks Rhaenyra's kids are bastards and ultimately won't be accepted by the people. I don't think it's paranoid to see the obvious future outcome of Rhaenyra's decisions. I think Alicent is just not so quick to give out her trust again. Which is actually fair since Rhaenyra is literally lying to everyone pretty much all the time lol.

  35. Rhaenyra was a teenager who lost her mother and had her dad marry her only friend. Lmao. She acted just about as impulsive and reckless as you'd expect. Nothing she did warrants the treatment she receives from Alicent.

  36. Honestly she handled that all very well. She could have easily spiraled into much worse. But no. She has sex once. And then gets married to a gay lord who won't have kids with her.. like what is she really to do?

  37. I wish he got his ass kicked more this episode but damn it was great to see his dumb face meet a fist

  38. I wanted to like her too but thought it was concerning that they had her use cersei's lines for her audition lol now it seems more fitting

  39. The whole telling of Olivia Cooke that she should play Alicent as a "woman for Trump" really sealed the deal for me in understanding that this show is definitely anti-Green.

  40. I don’t really have a side. The whole story of ASOIAF shows the faultiness of good kings and hereditary leadership. But the fact that Alicent is going against both the King’s wishes and her son’s wishes is telling. She thinks of herself as a Hightower and not as a member of House Targaryen, which means she should have no place telling the blood of the dragon how to rule. Viserys should have agreed to the pact and be done with it. Aegon is his son.

  41. I was always on Rhaenyra’s team. I read the book and I liked her character. Alicent wasn’t her close friend in the book but they made Alicent wayyyy bitchier in the show. Ser Criston screams incel 😂

  42. No. Though I find the younger green kids to be super interesting. Aemond is a bullied young man with a lot of insecurities and Helaena is like a neuroatypical savant with dragon dreams. Incredibly cool!

  43. The past few episodes have shown us that Alicent and Rhaneyera did not know how to “play the game” of politics like they should, and in this episode we’re finally seeing them kind of learning how to do it a little better. It makes me very excited.

  44. I thought it was interesting how Rhaneyera maintained pleasantries while going to see the Queen. I thought it was a good example of how she’s grown up and has a better understanding of how to play the game.

  45. I think Rhaenyra made the right choice in not running away with Christen. He would've treated her so badly if she got him mad. He probably would've been an abuser.

  46. I've been thinking about this since episode 5. He totally would have tried to control and dominate her. If she left with him to Essos she would have lost any power and agency she had and would be totally dependant upon him. Knowing what we know about his violent temper and her strong sense of individuality, he clearly would have emotionally/verbally abused her and most likely physically as well.

  47. All of them would be solved. Question of succession? Solved. Multiple lovers outside of wedlock? No problem. These are pretty much all her issues lmao

  48. Yeah, the fact that basically all of Rhaenyra’s issues are a result of the oppressive patriarchal system they live in always made me sympathetic toward her.

  49. Alicent is obsessed with Rhaenyra and who she’s fucking in a psychotic way. I can’t help but see Rhaenyra as the more sympathetic character now. Olivia and Emma both killed it this episode though!

  50. I mean Rheanyra swore on her mother's grave to Alicent that she remained a maiden. Alicent believed her so strongly that she went against her father's words to support her. Because of her support, her father gets removed as Hand of the King and kicked out of the King's Landing. Then she finds out that Rheanyra lied to her and fucked a knight. She hurt her father over a lie. Fast forward ten years and Rheanyra is on her 3rd bastard son to another knight. Meanwhile she has 2 trueborn sons of the King.

  51. Alicent is a miserable paranoid woman who's been on a path to tear down another woman out of jealousy, fear, hate. And she's about to turn her children miserable and terrible just like how her dad turned her into one. Daemon was at least fun to watch because he's unpredictable. He didn't act out of malicious intent. He's just difficult to control.

  52. Objectively, we as viewers with insight know that Alicent and her children were in no danger from Rhaenyra at any point until this episode. According to HOTD the greens most definitely started the war. Alicent AND Criston both got their feelings hurt over perceived slights. Her relationship with both didn't change until they made it so.

  53. I’ve genuinely enjoyed the Greens as some interesting characters and I do enjoy complex villains (gotta say I LOVE LOVE LOVED Larys’ childlike innocent smile after doing the bloodiest of deeds. I’m seeing some Moriarty-level pure psychopathic joy here 🤌💋). But GOD the child abuse I cannot stand…

  54. i am surprised why everyone’s missing Rhaenyra’s plain agendas here and i will take Alicent’s side on this one, only reason she is only offering his son’s hand because he’s bastard , him being married to Viserys daughter will make his claim stronger. Alicent sees thorough Rhaenyra here

  55. I feel like there's a pretty apparent side that the showrunners want the viewers to take at this point. I was kind of hoping that they'd continue on the same as they did the first 5 (4.5?) episodes and paint both sides in a somewhat sympathetic light. Instead, we got Queen Unreasonable Bitch, Ser Severus-Snape-never-got-over-woman-who-refused-him-so-he-takes-it-out-on-her-kids Cole, and Psycho Larys Strong.

  56. Depends on what you mean by likable. GoT has always had clear cut villains, but they are still enjoyable to watch and even to root for sometimes, like Cersei.

  57. Team Black, always have been. Fuck Alicent! I loved watching her this episode. The way she acts is hilarious. She likes to pretend that all the shit she did was necessary and righteous, but here in this episode she was digging her own grave

  58. Reading this thread the lot of you seem to forget what show were watching. It’s the Game of Thrones. You say Rhae would never try to murder Alicents kids. But once Viserys dies what would happen next?

  59. It's hard to not support Rhaenyra because I live in 2022, and the things Rhaenyra does that are so "indecent" (ex: extramarital sex) are ... not that big of a deal nowadays? She's also very tolerant of her gay husband, which, again, is more in line with 2022 culture. So I guess it's hard for me to pity Alicent when she's whining about the "indecency." I get that it's a different culture, but she's wrong. It's full-on misogyny and she's fucking supporting it.

  60. Ya I think it’s wildly interesting watching her because if she considered letting Rhaenyra off the hook she’d have the overwhelming pain of her situation crush her. So she’s just flailing and complaining- the proverbial wife who nags like a dripping faucet. I loved seeing Olivia animate her sense of fear as she realized what Larys had done. She’s complains incessantly but her reach and power at the Red Keep has obviously grown in the last decade, she can get away with almost anything… but in that one moment the game changed and you could see real fear. I’m excited to see how she plays the game within this bigger and more hostile landscape.

  61. Right? I was hoping the show would try to level that a bit and make it difficult to truly “choose sides,” but they’ve made Alicent a real Aunt Lydia without any sympathetic characters for allies. Maybe they’re trying to recreate the natural sympathy and investment we had in the Starks in GoT, idk.

  62. I'm team black, but I found Aegon II and Aemond a lot more likable than I expected. Before the sparring scene, of course.

  63. I hate alicent so much, she's the typical blindly following customs and heartless bitch. She was the empress of the right doing but now she's got her hands full of blood and she's a coward murderer. Her kids lol ok exactly like the awful human she is. One has to be nuts by being on her side still.

  64. I could also see how if Nyra and Daemon have kids she will go through the same steps with Laenor claiming they are his kids as well and that’s when they stop harassing her about how her kids look like and war ensues…just food for thought

  65. Funnily enough if you breed a black horse you have a decent chance of a chestnut foal lol. Black is a recessive gene and chestnut is dominant so it wouldn’t be a big surprise if the foal was chestnut. Sorry just a bit of irrelevant horse nerdery for you.

  66. Yea. weren't she and Laenor on the same page re: heirs and "duty to the realm"? I mean..its regretful the Viserys/Alicent situation forced their hand into getting married. But still.. Majorly bad decision on their part.

  67. This hahaha. She and Laenor should’ve tried having at least one baby before they… dined to their tastes.

  68. i spent the past week defending criston because i thought a lot of people oversimplified his change in episode 5, just for him to act like a cunt this whole episode lmaoo

  69. I like how people think that one side is better than the other as if both sides aren’t evil as hell. As Shireen Baratheon put it, “I wouldn’t have chosen either. It’s all the choosing sides that made everything so horrible.”

  70. And to that I respond with The Witcher. When dealing with Greater and Lesser evils, we all choose eventually. Even if we don't like the choice.

  71. Well alicent is a bitch.. But why would she want to marry her daughter to a bastard (where everybody knows)

  72. I only find it funny in the context that both Alicents and Rhaenyra’s children are the same amount of Targaryen like if they joined together it’s not like the Targaryen sides of them wouldn’t be the exact same still. It’s the Hightower and Strong that oppose one another but the blood of the dragon runs through both sets of children

  73. Stability. If the dragons arevunited no one has a chance against her, but the way she is grooming Aegon it will certainly lead to civil war

  74. She doesn't want to marry her daughter off to illegitimate kids is how I read that rejection of Rhaenyra's offer.

  75. I don't think I'm on anyone's side anymore. Sure Rhaenyra seems like the more sympathetic character despite her 'transgressions' but we shouldn't forget that Alicent has first been groomed and emotionally abused by otto, and Laerys, the biggest snake in this whole court, has been manipulating her ever since Otto left. Her behavior seems petty but giving everything she's gone through I can honestly see why she is the way she is

  76. Nah I've been team Rhaenyra all the way. Have to see more of the kids first though. Aegon doesn't seem so bad though (famous last words I know), just a typical teen. You say Daemon is a monster, but Larys is fucking vile. Daemon probably wouldn't burn his brother alive like that.

  77. Despite the fact that Alicent is a bitch, at this point, I still support the greens. I don’t think she is evil, like Criston or Larys, just very bitter - which is quite understandable.

  78. I've never been a Green, but Alicent was a personal favorite and very sympathetic character... until this episode. Don't get me wrong, I still like her, but she really messed up.

  79. Alicent is upset with rhyneara because she lied to her and swore on her mothers grace that her virginity was intact. That’s why she is being a spiteful shrew. She had lost all faith in her friend and now believes everything she says is a lie

  80. i still on rhaenyra’s side, she is rebellious and like the way she does not care about anyone else than her and her children. alicent is fucking insane, hate her since she wore her mothers dress…

  81. Been on team black since the beginning. It'll probably stay that way. No matter what happens, Rhaenyra is the rightful heir.

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

Author: admin